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Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood (Read 102886 times)
NaturalRogue
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #15 - Aug 26th, 2005 at 12:30pm
 
I must say that I'm finding this thread a very fascinating discussion. In fact, I've re-read the entire thread again this morning.

Funny how societal trends and stereotypes exists even for us longhairs.  For example, when I read the first post, my mind conjured images of a constrasting nature: the stern, bob-cut, over-the-top feminist and the free, eco-friendly, hippie girl. Very limiting stereotypes, I admit, but that is what came into my head. So, even I, as a long hair, associate flowing tresses with some ideal of femininity.

Do not misunderstand, short cuts can be extremely cute and very good looking as well; dare, I even say "sexy". Here, again though, my first instinct is to use the "cute" with a short cut on the better gender.

What's the point of all this rambling? Long hair, I think, might go beyond a simple stereotype. In history, painting, literature, women generally have long hair and this has become ingrained in all of us. In the past (heck even sometimes today) women would show their grief over loss by cutting their hair. In the 20s, the "bob" was the rage and initially rather scandalous. In medieval times (and perhaps earlier, though I can't be sure), young unmarried women left their hair long and free flowing; as soon as they were married, the hair was hidden.

Now, as for men and long hair, I think there is a an opposite effect. For the most part, historically the norm was for short hair. Can't easily put your head into a knight's helmet with long tresses. The roman man typically did not have long hair either. Somewhere between the 16th and 18th centuries, men wore wigs to simulate long hair. Many of these examples are the upper classes, no one can be positive about the lower classes. We can think of some long hairs, most germanic tribes, the celts, and the scots probably had long hair. And what did the ruling classes think of these folks? They were barbarous, unfit, outcasts.

Just some thoughts that I thought might contribute to this great thread.
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bikerbraid
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #16 - Aug 26th, 2005 at 2:27pm
 
Long hair on men was more typical in history than most think.  Even in the US, long hair on men was not uncommon for the "common folk" into the early 20th century.  I read somewhere (drat, I can't find it now) that WWI was significant in creating the men's short hair as the typical style out of necessity, which of course, carried on after the war as the service men realized the shorter hair was easier to care for.
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #17 - Aug 26th, 2005 at 3:16pm
 
Yes, military tradition has affected a lot to men's hairstyles.

If you look at medieval and renaissance paintings, many men wear bob type cuts. Before modern age, most people -men as well as women- haven't been able to afford going to a barber, and cuts were simple, practical and such that could be easily done at home. Though maintaining gender distinction was important, hairstyles were "bowl head cuts" (that are still worn by eg. Amish men) and bob type cuts.

In military, on the other hand, it was important to keep lice away, so shaving hair or getting extremely short cuts came in fashion. After wars, short cuts were made a bit more elaborate, and men got used to have their hair cut in salon. Now, medieval hair lengths are considerd rather longish on men.
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #18 - Aug 26th, 2005 at 5:43pm
 
I've always believed that how one wears their hair should be based on how they want to wear their hair- some ladies look fabulous in short hair,and some men look downright sexy in long hair.
Now- having said that-I'm always very pleased when I see an older lady with long hair- their is something special about it. I saw a lady at my old church with  beautiful snow white braided bun- It looked so pretty and elegant.  I think long hair suits most older ladies.
I think a lot of older women labor under the impression they can't wear their hair long- perhaps due to societal
pressure- but also b/c they may be thinning, or think they have to dye or perm their hair.  Some people have a hard time growing out dyed hair(me). I've come to the conclusion I've either got to go natural and grow long- or keep it short and colour it. My hair is just too fragile to grown long while I keep up the dyeing.
And the texture of grey hair can be different from pigmented hair, so they think they can't grow that out and have it look good. They usually don't have the long haired boards for support- so they think they have no choice but to keep it short.
I personally know people who say- I can't grow it out its too thin- grey-hard to manage,ect.
Long hair is easier in many ways as far as daily styling,but can be more work as far as keeping it in good condition, too.
My 80 years old Aunt, who loves to travel with my uncle, deliberatly keeps her hair very short and permed b/c she says she doesn't have to mess around styling it when she goes on trips to Europe,ect.
Women of my mom's and aunts generation wore their hair permed , styled and hairsprayed in their heyday-so they will usually continue to wear it that way. as an above poster pointed out. My dear mother in law (who passed this year at 93) wore her hair short and permed or curled all her life. I saw a picture of her in Marcel waves via about 1930's- looked good the idea of growing her hair long was foriegn to her.
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #19 - Aug 26th, 2005 at 5:46pm
 
I think most men- with rare exception( and this is just my opinion of course!!) look good with a little hair- that shaggy, unkempt sexy look long short or mid-length hair.
I was sad when dh cut his shaggy curls so short now b/c he's thinning on top!!
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #20 - Aug 26th, 2005 at 7:49pm
 
I'm jumping in on this conversation a bit late.  But it is an interesting topic.

For me, long hair and womanhood vary on a case-by-case business.  Some may feel like their femininity is based upon their long, flowing hair, others may feel like their sense of womanhood comes from their clothing, body, makeup, fashion, etc.

In a strange way, I'm glad that ALL women don't wear their hair long.  It makes us stand out.
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #21 - Aug 26th, 2005 at 11:13pm
 
Okay, this is for you NR.  Despite my earlier comments, I saw a long hair guy from the back today and I thought it looked good -- then I realized his hair was similar to yours in color and texture!  See, you're mellowing me Wink

Babyfine- my grandmother who died a few weeks before her 100th birthday this year also had short permed hair almost her entire life.  In fact she got one of the first perms ever done in her town (a dollar a curl, 75 curls!  and that would have been ~1921)

Panpeus - I agree, I'm glad not everyone has long hair so we stand out more Cheesy

DH has had a full beard most of our marriage, which I love.  So I guess I do like "hairy" men, just a different distribution Grin

I have often wondered about the styles-hair and clothing- of the working classes in earlier times.  It seems we have records of mostly the wealthy people, for obvious reasons.  I tend to think whatever hairstyles they had were very practical.  They had to work so long and so hard every day I doubt they had time, money,  or energy to be fussing over hair very much.
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #22 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 1:25am
 
Precious Locks, thank-you for the great compliment, although, I wasn't in the least taken aback by your previous posting. Still, thank-you for the lovely compliment.

Many have mentioned WWI as a defining moment for men and short hair. I am most curious as to what the basis for this is? I am do not recall many (or any) images of men prior to WWI with long or even longish hair? I do not mean this as a challenge, I only wish enlightenment. Nothing in my recollection (and granted it is tarnished at my ripe age) provides images of men with long hair with minor exceptions, (i.e. Buffalo Bill, Custer...) post civil war.

I would guess, unless someone corrects my poor memory, that most working class individuals (peasants, share croppers, serfs, etc.) probably chopped their hair to avoid interfering with their work.

I look forward to more debate and insight on this topic.

ETA Corrected a typo.
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« Last Edit: Aug 27th, 2005 at 2:45pm by NaturalRogue »  

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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #23 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 3:33am
 
Well, I think wehat they hsow in history si sometimes deliberately not shown. Like showing men with long hair may conjure up ideas which are generally socially unacceptable for hwo a man should appear. Again, I  hope I dont sound like too much of a conspiracy theorist, but alot of times things are conveniently left out so that people won't get  ideas.The reason for thsi is becasue if one small htign begins...it leads to others. There were plently of men prior to WW2 who hadl ong hair maybe just below the shoulder and ket ina pony tail. Alot of times as mentioned before, it was men of the working class and below. I also htink that there wa also a significant drop in long haired men after the 1800s as well. But WW2 was indeed marking point for convenience hair cuts.

I don't know...but I feel like evrything is conveneice nowadays. Oh if only people knew how fesh churned butter and frehs baked bread tasted like compareed to pre-mad ehtings. The same goes for hair. People wnat somethign fats and easy and dont want to work hard for something. In essence, i think society in general has become lazy.
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #24 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 12:26pm
 
I can't believe I missed this until now. 

I'll be back when I have more time to add my 2 cents, because it was getting really long and I'm gonna be late.   Roll Eyes
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #25 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 4:08pm
 
Precious Locks- a dollar a curl-75 curls=$75.00- amI thinking right?  In 1921 that was a lot of money!!!
My MIL also had thick hair(well for a 93 year old) up until she died. Her two daughters(my SIL) are late 50's and early 60's and have thick hair as well.
My momwears her hair in a chin length bob- is 79 and it it just now starting to thin at the part I noticed.
I had one grandma on my dads side that died age 94- but she was nearly bald-Her hair started thinning in her 50-60's and I also remember her wearing a wig when I was a little girl- I hop I don't inherit those hair genes!
I think mabe the daily wig wearing may have exacerbated her alopecia, though.
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #26 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 4:12pm
 
The option of growing my hair out long is just... completely essential to me.  I feel feminine with long locks.  It's just so comfortable and natural to me, even if I don't wear my hair down every day. 

I don't think from a woman's standpoint that to be an assertive female you must have short hair.  I've actually found that men respect me more FOR having long hair.  Granted, I'm not climbing the corporate ladder and I can't say I've hit the "glass ceiling" either, but I think in the feminist movement some have struggled so hard to be on the same plane as men that they've forgotten the respect due to us just because we are women.

For my part, I've noticed men listen to me more often when my hair's down.  ???  Why, I'm not really sure, but I've also noticed that they're more likely to open doors and grant those little niceties of a time gone by.  Why?

Well, I think men have come to a point that (for the most part.. there are some exceptions  Tongue) they can now view women in the workplace, on a even playing field with themselves.  That is due (with many many thanks) to the strong and assertive women who came before us, who fought for our right to vote, our right to work, our right to be both mothers and careerists.  But just because we have shown that we can be assertive doesn't necesarrily mean we have to rush out and make ourselves *look* the part

As women, we have gradually and wonderfully taught men to respect us, but I think we needn't be rough around the edges to prove it.  Whether your hair is long short or inbetween, we have all worked so hard to garner the respect that is due to us.  It's just my opinion that my "traditionally" feminine looks can hold just as much merit as the buzz-cut feminist activist.

... that's not saying if you have a buzz cut you're a feminist activist... I was just making a broad visual generalization there....
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #27 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 5:44pm
 
Well said, novusfemina!
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #28 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 8:11pm
 
Nicely put.

There's a book that's based upon many of the topics we've discussed.  It's called The Beauty Myth:  How Images of Beauty are Used Against Women.  By Naomi Wolf.  Definately worth checking out if you find this thread interesting.
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Re: Short Hair and teh Struggle for Womanhood
Reply #29 - Aug 27th, 2005 at 11:09pm
 
Babyfine -- yes, you're thinking right, but I swear that is the family story!  I have no idea how or why she would have paid that much money.

I've got to go find NR's party -- I'm missing a good one -- although I just came from a pretty good RL party this afternoon.
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